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Black & Chestnut Pure Polish Stallions?


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#1 hrpsylentstar

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Posted 02 April 2013 - 06:55 AM

I am leasing a bay pure Polish mare for this year, with the option of leasing her again after she foals. If that happens, I would like to breed her for a pure Polish foal (my stallion is 75% Polish). I do NOT want a homozygous agouti foal-so bays are out of the question because it is to much of a risk. 

 

I could probably tolerate a homozygous agouti foal as long as the foal wasn't also homozygous black. I will be using this foal in my breeding program and it somewhat ruins the surprise of color when your only option is bay-LOL.

 

I also prefer no grays...my current stallion is already gray so I am looking for a different color. However, sometimes I can be persuaded on gray. After all...its a gamble of a 50% chance of getting gray as long as the stallion isn't homozygous gray. 

 

So...I am looking for a chestnut (non-agouti preferably) pure polish stallion or a black pure polish stallion. 

 

Any ideas?

 

I am in LOVE with Opus One+ but fear he is no longer with us (although Datasource doesn't have him listed as deceased). Opus One+'s sire, AAF Kaset+ is a closely related to my stallion through their shared damlines of Kasta, and they also share *Aladdinn. Opus One+  - or any non-agouti son of AAF Kaset+ would DEFINITELY be something I am interested in crossing on this mare.

 

I also quite like the stallion Czersk by Goliat but his owners are not shipping semen and since I live in MI, I am not willing to haul to Pennsylvania for live cover.

 

I have also looked into Elikzer by Ganges, but both his parents are bay so I worry he is homozygous agouti. I emailed his owners to see if they knew his agouti status and they have not responded for whatever reason.

 

The mare is a beautiful daughter of Edukt and out of a Negatraz daughter. She herself may be homozygous agouti, I have to test her when I bring her home for that and her black status.


Standing PM Backfire (MS Firedevil x MS Kora)

2005 Polish Related Arabian Stallion

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www.diamondminearabians.com


#2 BFF

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Posted 02 April 2013 - 07:04 AM

I would definitely suggest Elikzir, I have a lovely daughter of his.


However Patti (his owner) can be difficult to get a hold of,via e mail or has been when I was purchasing horses from her.

You need to pick up the phone and CALL her.

 

Here is a video of my Pure Polish Elikzir daughter as a yearling.

 

She is out of a Bay *Aladdinn daughter.

 


Bonn-Fyre Farms/Training Center home to- 2014 Region II Champion Stallion SHIH, PACIFIC SLOPE TOP FIVE  STALLION 2014, Region II Top Five Stallion 2014 Pure Polish- Elikzir (Ganges x Ularia),

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#3 AccentoArabians

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Posted 02 April 2013 - 10:09 AM

I would definitely suggest Elikzir, I have a lovely daughter of his.


However Patti (his owner) can be difficult to get a hold of,via e mail or has been when I was purchasing horses from her.

You need to pick up the phone and CALL her.

 

Here is a video of my Pure Polish Elikzir daughter as a yearling.

 

She is out of a Bay *Aladdinn daughter.

 

 

Ooo...she'd look nice in my pasture! ;) Lovely girl!


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KL Lalita (*Kluszyn X Malitaa) --her 2012 filly by Mr Holly Fire (Afire Bey V X Zodiac Matador daughter)
Ames Dutchess (Philander Bey X Contessa Parada (Gai Parada))
RoyalesCarmenJazz (KC Rouge Royale X Beaux Suada)

Petita (Heritage Bey King X Zsa Zsa Ghazi (*El Ghazi))

#4 BFF

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Posted 02 April 2013 - 10:15 AM

Ooo...she'd look nice in my pasture! ;) Lovely girl!

---------

 

Accento she definitely dresses up a place!

 

I really adore her.

 

She will be three at the end of May.  I am on the fence as to if I breed her this year to my now 29 year old *Procent son or wait............

With a 29 year old stallion you can not count on next year!


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Bonn-Fyre Farms/Training Center home to- 2014 Region II Champion Stallion SHIH, PACIFIC SLOPE TOP FIVE  STALLION 2014, Region II Top Five Stallion 2014 Pure Polish- Elikzir (Ganges x Ularia),

7 Time U.S. National Top Ten Stallion LA LegacyInBlack+++//,

U;S. National Champion Stallion H/A SHIH- The Terminatorr+(Azh Naborr x L'argent- German Verband Hanoverian) 

https://www.facebook...571022559602050


#5 AccentoArabians

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Posted 02 April 2013 - 10:23 AM

Ooo, that would be a hard one. She's young, but it would be a heck of a foal!


KL Lalita (*Kluszyn X Malitaa) --her 2012 filly by Mr Holly Fire (Afire Bey V X Zodiac Matador daughter)
Ames Dutchess (Philander Bey X Contessa Parada (Gai Parada))
RoyalesCarmenJazz (KC Rouge Royale X Beaux Suada)

Petita (Heritage Bey King X Zsa Zsa Ghazi (*El Ghazi))

#6 BusyGal

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Posted 02 April 2013 - 10:52 AM

I'm not an expert on bloodlines but I know one stallion that I have personally seen (holds a lot more weight than just thinking you know a stallion by pictures) and I REALLY like. ARMANNI is his name, and he is a Monogramm son, out of SS Anita. I am very picky on stallions and I really looked him over. His conformation is correct and he is a "using" horse. The best part is his quiet demeanor. He has a really nice temperament. If you google his name with "arabian stallion" you should find videos of him around. He is standing in Oregon I think. He is a beautiful gold SHINEY chestnut. His pedigree is packed with great horses; great bloodlines that are slowly disappearing as they aren't the "flavor of the month". His owner is a very knowledgeable person about polish bloodlines and she has researched extremely thoughly all the polish horses. She also stands a bay polish stallion, SS Hypnotic that has produced some very nice horses too.



Off topic question: Whats wrong with homozygous agouti? Personal color preference or something genetic?


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#7 zai

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Posted 02 April 2013 - 11:12 AM

Armanni also has a full brother named Annapolis who is even more accomplished as a performance horse....and I won't suggest you look at the Toskara Addis auction lots....


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#8 hrpsylentstar

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Posted 02 April 2013 - 02:17 PM

I'm not an expert on bloodlines but I know one stallion that I have personally seen (holds a lot more weight than just thinking you know a stallion by pictures) and I REALLY like. ARMANNI is his name, and he is a Monogramm son, out of SS Anita. I am very picky on stallions and I really looked him over. His conformation is correct and he is a "using" horse. The best part is his quiet demeanor. He has a really nice temperament. If you google his name with "arabian stallion" you should find videos of him around. He is standing in Oregon I think. He is a beautiful gold SHINEY chestnut. His pedigree is packed with great horses; great bloodlines that are slowly disappearing as they aren't the "flavor of the month". His owner is a very knowledgeable person about polish bloodlines and she has researched extremely thoughly all the polish horses. She also stands a bay polish stallion, SS Hypnotic that has produced some very nice horses too.



Off topic question: Whats wrong with homozygous agouti? Personal color preference or something genetic?

 

 

I saw him on the SHN Payback list, and his brother, didn't click on them but I will look him up :)

 

A homozygous black + homozygous agouti horse is only ever going to produce a bay foal (unless bred to a gray...then its a bay foal at birth who has a 50% of graying out later). I adore bays-they are my favorite color. But there is something about getting to guess the color when a baby arrives, and if my only choice is bay...it kind of ruins the fun. Its probably a silly reason..but if I am breeding to keep I might as well breed what I want. :D

 

 

 

I would definitely suggest Elikzir, I have a lovely daughter of his.


However Patti (his owner) can be difficult to get a hold of,via e mail or has been when I was purchasing horses from her.

You need to pick up the phone and CALL her.

 

Here is a video of my Pure Polish Elikzir daughter as a yearling.

 

She is out of a Bay *Aladdinn daughter.

 

 

VERY nice filly! Love her face! I have a thing with faces...if anyone's looked at my stallion (who's a PP grandson), you'd understand why. He is very exotic in his head and I want something pretty headed. I know it'd be hard to get a pure polish horse with his head so I know that's unrealistic, but as nice of head as I can get would be awesome.


Standing PM Backfire (MS Firedevil x MS Kora)

2005 Polish Related Arabian Stallion

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#9 John

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Posted 02 April 2013 - 05:16 PM

I'm not an expert on bloodlines but I know one stallion that I have personally seen (holds a lot more weight than just thinking you know a stallion by pictures) and I REALLY like. ARMANNI is his name, and he is a Monogramm son, out of SS Anita. I am very picky on stallions and I really looked him over. His conformation is correct and he is a "using" horse. The best part is his quiet demeanor. He has a really nice temperament. If you google his name with "arabian stallion" you should find videos of him around. He is standing in Oregon I think. He is a beautiful gold SHINEY chestnut. His pedigree is packed with great horses; great bloodlines that are slowly disappearing as they aren't the "flavor of the month". His owner is a very knowledgeable person about polish bloodlines and she has researched extremely thoughly all the polish horses. She also stands a bay polish stallion, SS Hypnotic that has produced some very nice horses too.

I am reposting something that I wrote in 2009 since it seems to apply so well to the renewed conversation about Armanni and Annapolis. The only thing I would add would be to confirm the outstanding temperament of these stallions. - John<p>Posted 19 November 2009 - 05:59 PM<p>I don't think that forces will ever align again for any son of *Monogramm to accomplish what their sire did in the breeding shed. The mares at Michalow, masterfully selected by Director Jaworowsky, blended perfectly to give us offspring that absolutely dominated the show ring in Europe and elsewhere. I definitely think that *Ganges and Ekstern are very important horses and will leave a superb legacy of their own.I am going to mention a great cross for *Monogramm that was utilized here in the U.S. Robbin Stewart leased a very rangy, classy chestnut mare who was much in the Priboj tradition to cross with *Monogramm. This mare was SS Annita. Annita's sire, Spark, was a powerful horse with multiple lines to Witraz and Wielki Szlem. Annita's dam Brusally Oraba was an own daughter of U.S. National Champion Race Horse, *Orzel and the Oaks winning Abhazja who's race record was a scintillating, 9(6-3-0). Abhazja's dam was the splendid full sister to *Bask and Bandola, Arfa. Robbin had 3 colts by *Monogramm. One was gelded and she sold the stallion Annapolis. Robbin retained the oldest of the cross, Armanni. All the brothers are wonderful horses and the two that were kept as stallions were campaigned successfully at the 2008 Sport Horse Nationals. Again, I will speak to what I know more intimately and comment on Armanni. It is clear that he is a very prepotent sire who can perpetuate a strong *Monogramm look since he is the product of two parents who were a like to like breeding with respect to pedigree and phenotype. A great example of Armanni's potential as a sire can be determined by checking out his daughter Constancja. Pictures enclosed are SS Annita (with foal), Armanni and Annapolis together (with Armanni being the one on the left) and Constancja a wonderful mare in her own right who traces in the tail female line to *Canberra, a full sister to Comet. - John Attached Thumbnails
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Off topic question: Whats wrong with homozygous agouti? Personal color preference or something genetic?


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John Schiewe

#10 hrpsylentstar

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Posted 03 April 2013 - 08:21 AM

I did view Armanni's video and am very impressed with his movement. I am a little concerned about the level of his croup, I understand that he is a performance horse and I am not looking for the "straight as a board" look of the Halter horses. However, the mare I am breeding is also a little off in that area and it is something that I don't necessarily need to improve a whole lot, but definitely don't want to be any worse . Here is a couple photos of the mare for comparison and hopefully you'll see my concern with breeding her with a stallion who has more of a angle on the back end then what she already has. I want something that will Halter as well as Perform. I have been spoiled rotten on my current stallion, that he can do both and now that is what I expect of every horse-LOL. 

 

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I was recently PMed regarding the stallion Prowidenz (*Ganges x Pleiadea by *Goliat), has anyone heard/seen him? Any opinions? I caught a glimpse of him on Korona and love his face.


Standing PM Backfire (MS Firedevil x MS Kora)

2005 Polish Related Arabian Stallion

SCIDS/CA Clear
www.diamondminearabians.com