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biteing problem in young stallion


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#21 Lacinda

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Posted 20 July 2011 - 11:36 AM

My 2 year old Paladin is just like this and for now he is keeping those jewels as he is such a nice young colt in every other way. I have found with him, its a lot to do with teething and so I always put a bridle with a thick egg butt on him and let him mouth that for some time, also I do the thing where we just push his head away.

I would love to stop it completely and I have thought of using some kind of tacky paper as I don't like nails. I think tacks glued to your hand might work too without as much penetration issue as a nail. Hot sauce is a great idea, I may try it :)

My colt is for sure going to learn......its a matter of when and how lol.
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#22 Ambar

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Posted 20 July 2011 - 11:47 AM

I'm with MaryJo on this one, but I do have another suggestion. Does he get turnout with another horse? A gelding of about his age would be perfect. They can play nip-me-bite-you to their hearts content and get it out of their systems, and you can enforce the "don't even THINK about using your mouth on me" rule. (I do raise young stallions together. They wear each other out so they don't wear ME out!)

"Each of us, no doubt, at one time or another has owned the best horse that ever looked through a bridle. I once owned a better one. Without taking time to prove it, I will simply admit it." -- Albert W Harris, "The Arabian Horse," The Horse, July-August 1944.

Ambar Arabians: http://ambararabians.com/

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#23 Dreamcatcher

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Posted 20 July 2011 - 12:01 PM

I'm with MaryJo on this one, but I do have another suggestion. Does he get turnout with another horse? A gelding of about his age would be perfect. They can play ######-me-bite-you to their hearts content and get it out of their systems, and you can enforce the "don't even THINK about using your mouth on me" rule. (I do raise young stallions together. They wear each other out so they don't wear ME out!)



Ambar, I have had Harley out with 2 pregnant mares and they have made a big impression on him. But he was still trying the bite me bite you game with us, and after the farrier visit on Sunday I added Viado, my gelding, to the mix. Viado is totally respectful of humans, meek and mild as they come, but he's a complete Tartar out in the pasture with the open mares. He's in charge and no mistake. So, I'm thinking young Master Harley may get a bit of an education from Mr. V too.

Muddy ~ You're right, if I smacked Harley hard enough and enough times to stop the mouthiness with him, it would be abuse. So we do the push away, now the stud chain and carrot stick and out on pasture with some adults whose respect he's got to earn.

In Harley's defense, his behaviour isn't awful and he's not mean. He's just unschooled. When he was a month old last year I got one of my feet crushed and was laid up pretty much til this spring and he got ZERO human handling, except to be petted and fed by the teenage barn girl. Unfortunately for him and me both, that means he and I have to make up for lost time. What would have been a piece of cake last year is now a bit more work because I'm short, he's gotten reallllly tall and he's also starting to try out various little colty behaviours like, "I'm WAAAAY taller than you are and when I put my head up you can't reach me" and "I'm gonna crowd your space and make YOU back out" and all those colty things that should have been fixed while he was still a little tyke. Once he figures out that I really am NOT going to take any more schyjt from him, he gets it and he's easy peasy. It's just a matter of can he catch on before I decide I'm tired of playing colty games with a friggin' 16 hand yearling? He's not that tall......yet......but he's getting there very quickly. I'm working him every day and correcting things I don't like and he's making progress. Now, can he make enough progress to keep his parts until Color Congress and the weather cools down? I really don't like to geld in this kind of heat.

Pat Lowe

 


#24 Ambar

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Posted 20 July 2011 - 12:05 PM

I agree, Pat, the boys just play differently from the girls. In my opinion, better turnout with pregnant mares than with no other horses at all, but I have seen (on much bigger farms than mine!) the social benefits to the stallions of being raised in bachelor bands. (There's research showing it lowers testosterone levels, too, which doesn't hurt. :) )

"Each of us, no doubt, at one time or another has owned the best horse that ever looked through a bridle. I once owned a better one. Without taking time to prove it, I will simply admit it." -- Albert W Harris, "The Arabian Horse," The Horse, July-August 1944.

Ambar Arabians: http://ambararabians.com/

Member of International Arabians in Sport Association and California-Nevada Arabian Sport Horse Association


#25 Lacinda

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Posted 20 July 2011 - 12:05 PM

Pat, I had the same issue with Paladin as I was kicked by a Percheron/Friesan and cracked my hip, was out of commission the whole 'babyhood' of Paladin as far as true handling went, sure I could foal him out and go pet him but a lot of his handling was on the fly by others and he got taught some things.

Now he is a 15.2 hand 2 year old and same thing, just tall and learning how big he is. Luckily I am strong again now and can deal with him and he is learning super fast.

He does bite, he does not just try to bite. So we are going to fix that shortly, it is the last real bad behavior he has to be gotten rid of .

He loves to wear the bridle which is his teething ring.
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#26 Mystic Rose

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Posted 20 July 2011 - 12:24 PM

My mouthy colt knows not to bite me, but he is still mouthy, when you go to halter, he grabs the halter so instead of going over his nose, it goes in his mouth. He isn't bitey so much as mouthy - he wants everything in his mouth. He plays with his toys, he bites at the buckets in his pasture, plays with sticks, etc... He was out with multiple geldings until this spring - and he was bottom of the pecking order. But he would still play bite at them constantly - he regularly had/has hoofprints in his chest. Its just his persona, he wants to play and it comes out there. This spring - he got to play with the girls - put 3 mares out with him, they are now all pregnant (yay) and he is still mouthy. But it seems like maybe not so much - he found another outlet for that energy, plus the mares are meaner when they nail him then the geldings were. And they are much more vocal, he sneaks up to nibble and they stamp and squeal. He's allowed to be right with them, but no lipping/chewing. I think the geldings let it stay a game too much, where the mares beat him up more. I actually do plan to geld him this fall, I have a senior stallion, never seriously planned on a second stallion, and I know that he is the type who is going to 'challenge' authority more often - which doesn't work camping at an endurance ride. I have a 'perfect' stallion behavior wise in my other guy, so I won't except less than that. My hope is that gelding and maturity will correct his mouthiness.

Jennifer Whittaker
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Home of: Summer Saga+ (Massar El Sabbah x Summer Savannah) - proven high mileage endurance stallion and SHIH Champion.
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#27 Donna S

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Posted 20 July 2011 - 01:09 PM

Somewhere I read that one idea was to carry a small bottle of that breath spray........and when they come around to ######.......give them a spray in the mouth. Sounds like something worth trying. I'm not sure if it works or not, but would like to hear from anyone who has tried it.

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#28 lkirby

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Posted 20 July 2011 - 01:53 PM

I would also suggest that you use verbal commands with your young stallion, such as "Ack Ack Ack" or "No" followed immediately by some disciplinary action.

But, sometime you have to really turn up the heat. I know this sounds brutal, but thirty years ago I was training a young Arabian stallion who kept on trying to bite me. One day he managed to bite my breast. I still have a scar from that incident. The next time he tried to bite me, I leaned over and bit him on the side of one nostril really, really hard and just hung on. He ran backwards about 30 feet with me still hanging on until I finally let go. He just stood there staring at me with an absolute shocked expression on his face. However, he never tried to bite me again.

Lorna G. Kirby, PE
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#29 msjwebb

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Posted 20 July 2011 - 02:27 PM

I have no answers for you as my 19 year old gelding has been mouthy sense I got him at 2. He plays with everything! So years ago when I was grooming him I gave him a face brush to play with while I cleaned him up. He still likes to play with it. When taking a bath he will not let you spray him until he gets a good drink from the hose. He would turn and his head when I would get on him so I used to put peanut butter on the bit so he had 10 minutes of fun time getting all of the peanut butter off before our rides. He was once nicknamed "the horse thief" at one of the boarding facilities I had him at as if you walk out into the field with something hanging out of your pocket or a hat on he would steal it in a heart beat! He only bit me once years ago, and I turned away from him real quick and my elbow hit his jaw. This was not on purpose but he never bit me again. He just likes to play and acts like a little kid trying to get mom's attention. His dam was the same way. He is quite the character and I would not change him for the world. He can open gates if not chained, open stalls if the clip is not put in, floods the pasture if I forget to put the lock on the spicket things like that. Never a dull moment. So good luck. I hope you can get yours to at least learn not to bite.

#30 OneMuddyTB

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Posted 20 July 2011 - 02:52 PM

The next time he tried to bite me, I leaned over and bit him on the side of one nostril really, really hard and just hung on. He ran backwards about 30 feet with me still hanging on until I finally let go. He just stood there staring at me with an absolute shocked expression on his face. However, he never tried to bite me again.

Lorna G. Kirby, PE


Oh, I've bitten back, too! It's pretty funny how effective it is on some of them. Others think it's an invite to start the bitey-face game like they do with each other every time they want to play.

I once bit a horse I was working with (fairly gently) in front of a brand new boarder. She looked at me like I'd grown a second head! After I stopped laughing, I explained that he bit me first. That didn't really make her any less confused...