Jump to content


Photo

Speed blood in Arabs?


This topic has been archived. This means that you cannot reply to this topic.
54 replies to this topic

#51 Rosealba Farm

Rosealba Farm

    Advanced Member

  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 1,135 posts

Posted 12 September 2009 - 05:29 AM

QUOTE (KizmetRanch @ Nov 30 2008, 12:40 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
I absolutely agree. Unfortunately my focus has been on stock horses because I don't know anybody personally in the Arabian world that is as knowledgeable and who could mentor me like that. If I get back into Arabians (and I sort of hope I do.. every experience with them has been nothing but wonderful, and I can't say the same about stock horses), maybe I'll try to research on my own.

Thanks for the article Morasgirl.

Stanislav, that's where I'm torn. I am talking about foundation Arabians... I'm just talking about the speed blood portion of them. This forum is huge, and it was hard enough finding my way here, let alone picking the proper thread to start it on. I'll find the racing part and crosspost to there...



There have been a few strong racing programs in the breed. Here is a very brief history of one program. The Kubela Ranch was one of the greats. They owned and raced the great Kontiki. John Rogers who owned Serafix was a big fan of endurance. He imported several desert racing mares from the Middle East who were not known for their beauty, but were very athletic. He bred those mares to Serafix and produced a couple of great stallions. Meteor was shown and raced. His daughters were crossed with Kontiki. SX Champion was by Serafix, out of Subaiha. He produced several race winning stallions out of Kontiki daughters and daughters out of Kontiki bred mares. These bloodlines are still being used and are still winning today as they cross well on the French and Polish lines. The Rogers and Kubelas were friends for many years. They crossed the Serafix with the Kontiki and produced many greats in Arabian racing. After Mrs. Rogers died and Mr. Kubela died, John Rogers married Robbie Kubela, sold the farm in CA and moved to Seguin, TX where they focused on race horses until the ranch was dispersed shortly before Robbie died. I have incorporated some of these lines into my own program. They are durable and athletic, and very good minded to boot. Here are some photos I pulled off the Datasource of these old horses. There are none of SX Champion, but I have included a photo of the daughter I have. She was raced at 4, has produced 3 winning race horses and we showed her successfully at 19 last year. She is shown with her 2009 colt by my Serafix grandson.

kontiki.jpg
Kontiki

Meteor.jpg
Meteor

thorayyah.jpg
Thorayyah

Subaiha.jpg
Subaiha

buddy2080109.JPG
Sheza Champ Ku and SX Valorrs Champion

#52 Marci

Marci

    Advanced Member

  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 348 posts

Posted 12 September 2009 - 08:01 AM

To expand some on Rosealba's post and to react to a statement made earlier that you were surprised that a mare had a CMK pedigree, it should be noted that many of the early race horses were of CMK descent. CMK (Acronym for Crabbet-Maynesboro-Kelllogg) refers specifically to horses that were imported prior to 1950, and meet certain bloodline requirements. Here is a link to a better definition: http://www.arieana.c...k/scwhatis.html

As Sue mentioned, Kontiki was (and is today) an important factor in many racing programs. Kontiki was also a horse that was shown at Halter and won at Scottsdale. According to Data Source, Kontiki lived to be just 10 years old, but what an influence. Looking at his pedigree, you see several of Arabian Racing's sought after bloodlines - Antez, Abu Farwa, Alla Amarward and his speedster son, Ziyadi. Legend has it that Ziyadi was largely match-raced on the SoCal river beds (prior to formal racing venues) and was unbeaten.

Abu Farwa is legend in racing pedigrees and his influence (like his grandson, Kontiki) carries down through generations. There are many race horses of today that combine these old bloodlines with the Polish, etc., for great race horses. Even unraced, the Abu Farwa lines breed on. My own mare, S S Salina (SX Saladin by Serafix and out of Shamillazzan - 4x to Abu Farwa), had one foal before coming to me, not sired by a race horse. That foal was put on the race track and was in the money 7 times in two seasons. Salina (17 years later) has produced a remarkable filly in 2008, sired by our pure Polish stallion, MHR Flame. Named Caddilac Red, I believe she has the conformation and the desire to race.

There is so much more that I can say about the Serafix/Abu Farwa lines - specifically through our stallion, Serazim. I will leave that for another post. This one has gotten pretty long. cool.gif

Here is an interesting article, written in 1998, about the Arabian Racing bloodlines. It is long, but packed full of info regarding CMK, Polish, French, Egyptian and Russian. http://www.roxannero.../raceblood.html

Attached Images

  • Salina_and_Red051808_1.JPG
  • Caddilac_Red_050209_2.JPG

Marci de la Torre
Pegasus Park Arabians
Wildomar, CA



Home of:
Seraphix (SX Staleys Gemini x Zia Bi Bask) - A *Serafix grandson out of a *Bask/CMK mare!!
Bright Rabba (FV Sharabba x Galana'Zi)- an exciting young Sharabba son out of a Galan/Ga'Zi daughter.
Jewel King (The Chessman x GA Celeste) A rare double Galan++ grandson.
MHR Flame(Port Bask x MHR Polanka) Pure Polish - Mekeel-bred!
A Touch Of Pride (Farlanes Pride+/ x Phylicity) The one and only son of Farlanes Pride+/ in the US.
SX Mister Brilliant (Serazim x BT Cameo by El Brillante). The only entire son of the great Serazim.

#53 Tanya

Tanya

    Advanced Member

  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 1,034 posts

Posted 03 February 2010 - 05:44 AM

I through in a little 'surprises' now and then to my breeding. But my mainstay is *Orzel. Combined with *Wiking and a little *Sambor, wow. (It might be the Priboj- my theory) but if I have two pedigrees the same and stand those two horses next too each other it's always going to be the 'heart' that wins the race. We haven't really gotten faster by breeding better, same for TB's. When I train, I go for confidence and attitude, I never throw out a horse because it has a racing clitch in the pedigree, because in the 80's I raced my all American every weekend. 21 crosses to *Raffles I think! Anyway here's a horse that can swing both ways.

#54 Selket Arabians

Selket Arabians

    Advanced Member

  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 381 posts

Posted 06 February 2011 - 05:22 PM

I am not into racing nor claim to know anything about it BUT when I purchased my stallion and was told of his racing career I was informed that he was FAST out of the gate and FAST to the front but once he was up there, he gave up.

I am not sure if that answers your question but he is by *Furno Khamal out of Mistical Lady (Tornado). I did let him go all out once over my fields and it was quite scary how fast he was in comparison to my gelding Moudy who is by Moudriey out of SC Shantily (Fadl Moniet) who seems to have more endurance than the initial speed.


He slowed down only because he was a "tail chaser" (not because he lacked speed or endurance). He was a paycheck horse with over 20 starts, I believe, and a paycheck horse is a fine thing to have.

Please say Hello to him for me and tell him his sisters, nieces and nephews are wishing him well.

He was a wonderful racehorse and his trainer still talks about him with respect. As a matter of fact, his trainer is working with our farm again, and picked a nephew of your stallion as one of his hottest racing prospects for this year.

- RH.
Fate 150.jpg

The Selket Arabians are a bloodline of taller-than-average Arabian sport horses and one of the oldest breeding herds in the United States. For many years, the horses have been line-bred on the 16.2 H international champion Furno Khamal. They are supported and managed by Ron Hevener & Co. (specializing in novels, collectible merchandise and apparel for animal lovers). The horses are raised on farms in the U.S. and Brazil. 


#55 Maigray

Maigray

    Advanced Member

  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 843 posts

Posted 12 February 2011 - 07:43 AM

Is speed blood important or highly influential in conformationally correct Arabians?


I would say the answer to your question is "yes." After reviewing the thread, your comments suggest there is a huge divide in terms of pedigrees that produce speed and pedigrees that do not in stock horses. I think this is where things are getting a little confusing. That divide is not nearly as wide in Arabians. Virtually every Arabian can trace to a successful racehorse at *some* point in its pedigree. You can take almost any Arabian, from any bloodline, put it on the track, and have a chance. Modern Arabian racing is just starting to specialize, but the pedigrees that back "old" speed blood in this breed back everything.